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Pte. Cecilia Cochrane Sunshine, ATS
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Tonym



Joined: 07 Oct 2007
Posts: 91
Location: East Sussex

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 5:32 pm    Post subject: Pte. Cecilia Cochrane Sunshine, ATS Reply with quote

I have two problems with this lady, the first being that she is recorded by CWGC as buried in Prestonpans New Cemetery that I cannot find on SWGP. I do however have a photograph of her grave acknowledged to ‘gourdongirl, Inveresk Cemetery’ but checking through that cemetery I cannot now find a photo of the grave. I have email gourdongirl to check if I have recorded the wrong cemetery but, so far, no response. Does anybody recognise the photo and where the grave is located also does Prestonpans New Cemetery exist?

My second problem is that I have recently received information that Cecilia died in the Royal Infirmary Edinburgh from compound fracture of the skull following gunshot wound. Would anybody have any further details regarding how she sustained the gunshot wound, press report, etc.?

Grateful for any assistance.

Tony
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DerekR



Joined: 04 Oct 2007
Posts: 809
Location: Hawick

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Severely wounded in the head by a buckshot rifle, Mrs Cecilia Sunshine, 29 High Street, Prestonpans was on Saturday admitted to Edinburgh Royal Infirmary. Mrs Sunshine, who is 19 years of age, was conveyed to the Infirmary by Red Cross ambulance"
- "Scotsman" Sept 14th, 1942.
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Tonym



Joined: 07 Oct 2007
Posts: 91
Location: East Sussex

PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Derek

No indication of accidental or deliberate. Don't know if there is any significance but no mention of her husband on CWGC Certificate only her parents. He was Arthur Sunshine, Gunner Royal Artillery.

Tony
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gourdongirl



Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Posts: 1066
Location: Musselburgh Scotland

PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have just been along to Prestonpans New Cemetery and there is a CWGC stone for her there.

I will post the photo over the weekend.

Shona
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kinnethmont



Joined: 25 Mar 2008
Posts: 121
Location: aberdeenshire

PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

She is entitled to war death status and a CWGC stone, regardless of the cause of her death, as she was serving in the A.T.S. at the time.
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In Flanders fields.
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Tonym



Joined: 07 Oct 2007
Posts: 91
Location: East Sussex

PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 7:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jim

She is commemorated, I am just curious as to the circumstances.

Death Cert quotes "Compound fracture of the skull result of gunshot wound", 11.30 pm 13th September 1942 (a Saturday) at 29 High Street, Prestonpans (quoted as usual residence), Informant registered as Arthur Sunshine, Widower, Gunner Royal Artillery.

CWGC Cert. quotes "Daughter of George and Helen Edmond of Prestonpans" No reference to husband.

No indication if accidental or ?.

Tony
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DerekR



Joined: 04 Oct 2007
Posts: 809
Location: Hawick

PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony,
In the case of a "suspicious" death, I would expect to see an abreviation on the certificate to indicate that it had been investigated.
Is there any such addition to Cecilia's?
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Tonym



Joined: 07 Oct 2007
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Location: East Sussex

PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 8:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nothing that I can see Derek.

What makes me suspicious is a 19 year old girl - 11.30 at night - a shotgun wound - suicide or what ?

Tony
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kenmorrison



Joined: 05 Oct 2008
Posts: 733

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sure there isn't an RCE (Record of Corrected Entry) associated with this death register entry?
I would have expected some kind of investigation by, or at least a comment from, the local Procurator Fiscal even in the case of the death of a serving member of the military.
Ken
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Tonym



Joined: 07 Oct 2007
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Location: East Sussex

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What I have, passed on to me by a colleague, is not an individual Death Cert. it is a page with 3 deaths recorded and Cecilia is the bottom one, what is different to her entry is the first column is blank in the top two but in hers there is a small oval stamp with, what looks like 'Recognition' hand written with other unreadable printing around it.

The other document is a 'Register of Corrected Entries' the only difference is she is recorded as "Cecilia Cochrane Edmund or Sunshine" whilst on the D.C. it is "Cecilia Cochrane Sunshine". Edmund is her parents surname.

Tony
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Tonym



Joined: 07 Oct 2007
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Location: East Sussex

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have just studied these two documents again - The document "Register of Corrected Entries" - First line reads "The following Report of a Precognition has been received touching the death of Cecilia..........."
This document is also dated 27th December 1943, 14 months after the death.

Searching Google to find out what 'Precognition' means produced, in one title. - "Precognition is psychic knowledge of something in advance of its occurrence. The faculty of seeing into the future is called "second sight" if it is not induced by ... ".

Unless there is another meaning for 'Precognition' that now leaves me completely confused as the oval stamp that I referred to in my previous email is not 'RECOGNITION' it is 'PRECOGNITION'

Tony
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kinnethmont



Joined: 25 Mar 2008
Posts: 121
Location: aberdeenshire

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Unless there is another meaning for 'Precognition' that now leaves me completely confused.......


Tony

It is not crystal ball reading.
Precognition is a legal term in Scots Law, which means investigation or enquiry. In the case of an RCE (Record of Corrected Entry ) it means that the facts were not fully known or confirmed when the death was first registered, in which case, legal enquiry is made and the Fiscal or Sherriff will give a written statement which is used for the RCE.

What does it say about her death in the RCE?
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Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.
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Tonym



Joined: 07 Oct 2007
Posts: 91
Location: East Sussex

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RCE = Compound fracture of the skull result of - gunshot wound

D.C. = Compound fracture skull 1 day following gunshot wound
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kinnethmont



Joined: 25 Mar 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2011 6:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony

Had it been considered suicide / accident / homocide I wouid have expected something to that effect to be detailed on the RCE.
Mystery continues.
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Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.
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Tonym



Joined: 07 Oct 2007
Posts: 91
Location: East Sussex

PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2011 8:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jim

It has to have been one of those three options and the addition of the family name 'Edmond' on the RCE suggests to me that this could have been at the parents request. I have my own thoughts as to why but not on here.
I have just looked at Scotlands People and the on line display is exactly the same as the print out that I have so I have to assume that a copy of the actual DC will be the same and a waste of credits, so a mystery it will probably remain.

Tony
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